Getting ready to drop some $$ on my first set of wood turning tools and I've got everything figured out except my scraper. I'm primarily interested in turning bowls and could use some advice on which one of these three I should get.
In order, the below pictures are:
1) Hurricane M2 Cryo 1" (x3/8") Heavy Duty Bowl Finishing Scraper....$114
2) Hurricane M42 Cryo 3/4" Bowl Finishing Scraper .......................................$82
3) Hurricane M2 Cryo 1" Round Nose Scraper ....................................................$76
At first I was thinking of getting the cheaper 1" round nose and grind / sharpen so that it has the profile of a bowl scraper. Is it ok to do this, or should I go for one of the other tools that are actual bowl scrapers? And if so, what's the advantage / functionality of the heavy duty scraper vs. the smaller 3/4" one?
Brad - everyone will have their opinion, but........I turn a lot of bowls and 95% of the time use a traditional 5/8" bowl gouge only. My bowl gouges have 55-60 degree bevels which generally gets it done for me. I will occasionally use a negative rake scraper (pretty heavy duty, not a lightweight) for some interior tear-out related issues, but it's rare. On those somewhat rare occasions where I go deeper than the width of the bowl, I have a "bottom-feeder" bowl gouge ground to about 85 degrees from an old traditional ground gouge someone gave me. On the exteriors of bowls, after shaping, I mostly shear-cut (tool handle down low and flute turned toward the bowl) with my bowl gouge and use the same bowl gouge as a scraper as needed. So, my 2-cents, use a bowl gouge (mostly) and a negative-rake scraper if necessary. Al Hockenbery, and a few other experienced turners that frequent this forum, probably have good videos showing how you turn the whole bowl with a traditional ground bowl gouge.
I invested in the Glenn Lucas negative rake scraper (woodturnerscatalog.com) a few months ago, and have not looked back. With a proper burr burnished on the edge, it is a joy to use and does a great and safe job of shaving off finishing cuts in the inside of bowls. I don’t know if I’ve gotten much use out of my traditional (single-bevel) scrapers on bowls since I made the purchase. One exception is a homemade scraper I made from a concrete demolition tool I found on the side of the road several years ago. It is a one inch steel rod about 30” long . Probably weighs ten pounds. The end is flattened spoon shape and I ground a scraping edge on it. It’s great for heavy stock removal from the inside of rough bowls.
Getting ready to drop some $$ on my first set of wood turning tools and I've got everything figured out except my scraper. I'm primarily interested in turning bowls and could use some advice on which one of these three I should get.
In order, the below pictures are:
1) Hurricane M2 Cryo 1" (x3/8") Heavy Duty Bowl Finishing Scraper....$114
2) Hurricane M42 Cryo 3/4" Bowl Finishing Scraper .......................................$82
3) Hurricane M2 Cryo 1" Round Nose Scraper ....................................................$76
At first I was thinking of getting the cheaper 1" round nose and grind / sharpen so that it has the profile of a bowl scraper. Is it ok to do this, or should I go for one of the other tools that are actual bowl scrapers? And if so, what's the advantage / functionality of the heavy duty scraper vs. the smaller 3/4" one?
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Get a negative rack scraper, the huge ones like 1 1/2 aren’t much better than the 1 inch ones I find, actually I like the 1 inch better, less area to catch When doing a fine scrape to clean up marks.
I purchased a number of scrapers 20yrs ago when I started turning. Scraped a few bowls back then... Now, as others have said, I seldom reach for a scraper. I do need to eventually invest in a negative rake one though. The scraper I use most often is a 1/4" x 1" Thompson slightly rounded that I clean up plates and platters with, otherwise most of them just gather dust for months on end until I use them for a few minutes on a particular issue. Of the couple dozen (or more) tools I have the 5/8" bowl gouge easily sees the most use. A small skew sees use on every bowl to make the tenon for my chuck, and usually a 3/8" bowl gouge, or a 3/8" detail gouge to clean off the bottom tenon when the bowl is completed. With that said, I wouldn't part with the others I have and continually think about getting more
What I don't get is, why would one invest in a negative rake scraper, if they already have a standard single-bevel (assuming the shape is how you want it to be, or could be ground to the shape you want) , all one would need to do, it seems, is take your single bevel scraper and grind a new bevel on the top, then grind your bevel again to raise a burr (or even, hone and raise a burr with a burnishing tool?) , voila, you have a negative rake scraper? Myself, I recently got a pair of PSI bowl scrapers (1" and 1-1/2" ) and while I have little practice in with them as yet, I was considering that I could just grind a negative rake into one or both, (but first I want to see if I can refine the shape I currently have on them, which does not "quite" fit the transitions I end up with - most of my difficulty now is on bowl bottoms just after the transition, invariably I seem to get a "ridge" in that area... )
…why would one invest in a negative rake scraper, if they already have a standard single-bevel (assuming the shape is how you want it to be, or could be ground to the shape you want) , all one would need to do, it seems, is take your single bevel scraper and grind a new bevel on the top, then grind your bevel again to raise a burr (or even, hone and raise a burr with a burnishing tool?)..,
Because, of course, I don’t want to sacrifice one of the 5 rarely used scrapers I already have…you can *always* use just one more tool
IF you're just starting out, I would not spend the extra money for cryo steel. Get a basic M2 scraper in the size you think you want and put the shape on it you think you want. Then, when you realize it's not quite right, you can change the shape until you get what actually works for you. And not worry about how much expensive steel you're grinding off in the process. Think you actually want a negative rake scraper? Fine, off you go to the grinder and turn your inexpensive scraper into a negative rake. After 5 or 8 years, when you're getting pretty good at this, and your cheap scraper is getting kinda short, buy that fancy steel. At that point, you'll be able to appreciate the longer lasting edge. Just my 2 cents.
What I don't get is, why would one invest in a negative rake scraper, if they already have a standard single-bevel (assuming the shape is how you want it to be, or could be ground to the shape you want) , all one would need to do, it seems, is take your single bevel scraper and grind a new bevel on the top, then grind your bevel again to raise a burr (or even, hone and raise a burr with a burnishing tool?) , voila, you have a negative rake scraper? Myself, I recently got a pair of PSI bowl scrapers (1" and 1-1/2" ) and while I have little practice in with them as yet, I was considering that I could just grind a negative rake into one or both, (but first I want to see if I can refine the shape I currently have on them, which does not "quite" fit the transitions I end up with - most of my difficulty now is on bowl bottoms just after the transition, invariably I seem to get a "ridge" in that area... )
You can pretty easily make a double bevel scraper (NRS) from a single bevel, but you probably don't want to go back and forth.
If you take a 70* single and add a 10* top bevel you will get an NRS, but it will be blunter with an included angle of 80* . To get back to a 70* included angle you'll have to grind the bottom bevel to 60* loosing a bit of metal in the process.
Now if you change your mind and want to go back to single bevel you not only have to return the bottom bevel to 70*, but you have to grind away all of that shallow 10* bevel on the top, and that is a lot of metal.
Thanks so much everybody for your advice, I always read word. I'd like to address everyone individually but I find I risk having my follow up questions disappear in the fray when I do.
I've had the suggestion that if I am considering buying the more expensive scraper that I might think about going with the Easy Wood Tools Finisher (carbide) instead. I understand the wisdom in the advice to get cheap tools first then see which ones I like/use invest in more expensive tools, but I'm a measure twice, cut once kind of guy so I tend to ask a bunch of questions. Any opinions on the Finisher vs. 3/8" NR scraper?
You can get a Thompson 3/4" scraper for $75 where the EWT is well over a hundred. With my CBN wheels I will never use all of my Thompson 3/4" scraper (and I wouldn't use it all if I was still using stone wheels). You know from demos you hear the pros saying that the scraper needs the burr to cut well and that the burr is gone in a few seconds but then you watch and he uses the scraper for minutes and if you watch closely if he needs it again he just picks it up again and uses it without resharpening. I don't use my 3/4" Thompson very often but I cannot remember the last time I sharpened it and it still does exactly what I need it to do. I have never felt the need to get an EWT tool and I would not take one if it were free as my Thompson does the same job. The only carbide I use regularly are the Hunter carbides.
Well, as a self proclaimed scraper psycho, I think the biggest appeal of the carbide scrapers, other than the Hunter tools which are cupped and designed to slice, is that they are small scrapers, which makes them easier to handle, especially for beginners. I do not like big wide thick scrapers. As I say in my Scary Scrapers video, I don't need anything over 1 inch wide and 5/16 thick.
As for cutting with and without burrs, this does present a puzzle. Most of the time, for scraping cuts, especially heavy ones, you want a burr. I was floored when I saw Nick Stagg do a demo in Salem, OR where he finish cut a hard maple lamp base that was side grain/bowl grain orientation, with a scraper. He honed off the burr and bevel. It left a very smooth surface. That type of edge does work in harder and more dense woods. It does not work in softer woods.
No idea how the carbide NRS works, or maybe I can't explain why it cuts. In theory, it shouldn't because the NRS needs a burr to cut. Apparently, it does work. A sharp edge does cut.
robo hippy
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